WSF Payment system - USSF and PayPal question

Ah-- ussf-tech is on my gmail account, along with drupal-dev, drupal-this, apache-that, journalism-this.... let's just say during WSF my personal e-mail backlog, which has no mailing lists, reached 500. I would have seen this within a couple days though when I do my review ;-)

Ask Charles about the DIA solution. I know that USSF used Democracy In Action for the communications backend in some way. My bias is toward a Drupal-only solution but we've lost some credibility in getting things done. Anyhow Charles' opinion on his own product will be more useful than his thoughts on other solutions.

I think he simply doesn't know that Drupal can easily be integrated with PayPal and a dozen other payment gateways (I know there was work on Google checkout but I'm not sure it's built into Drupal's e-commerce or ubercart yet, I'm sure someone has a working implementation though). That is, there's no issue of the payment info being separated from the use data (the sensitive financial info, card numbers, on the other hand need never be stored).

ben

Hey Ben,

aren't you in the USSF-tech list?

Jason

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Charles Lenchner < clenchner@democracyinaction.org>
Date: 3-dic-2007 16.55
Subject: RE: [Ussf-tech] About paypal and the USSF
To: Josue Guillen josue@thepraxisproject.org, Jason Nardi < jason.nardi@gmail.com>
Cc: ussf-tech@lists.mayfirst.org

I recommend not using Paypal for the following reasons...

1. There are advantages to having financial information be located in the
   same database as other info (say, contact information) related to an
   individual. With Paypal, you end up with a separate data silo that needs to
   be integrated consistently (bad) or not integrated and kept separate
   (worse.)

2. Paypal's income is based on a percentage of each donation. This is fair
   and reasonable, but I'd want my percentage to go to a vendor specializing in
   nonprofits or political entities, so that there is, 'someone to go to' if
   any issues arise.

3. Being hypocritical, I'm attracted to the Google checkout system. It has
   some flaws, but it's free for nonprofits. Assume for a moment that you
   eventually raise $100,000 over the internet. Saving 3 per cent means you
   keep an additional $3000.

4. I'm not an expert on the issues of international credit card processing.
   I know that there are some risks with people using a card that somehow isn't
   accepted by a particular processor. But... I wonder just how big that issue
   is. My friends from Europe/Middle East generally find that their cards work
   in the US without a problem. Is it different elsewhere?

5. Whatever decision you make, do make sure that the following
   voices/concerns/tasks are part of the conversation.

6. Do you want to be able to send emails to people based on their giving
   history?
7. Do you want to preserve the information about donors and use it in the
   future, including one day after WSF2008?
8. Will you find it useful to look at data of donations, participation,
   volunteering, and attendance at the same time?
9. Does your plan for managing data have a sunsetting component? In other
   words, if you do want to destroy your own records at some point, can you
   articulate right now how that process will proceed?
10. If you do not have such a process, who does keep the data? What
    organizational entities have claim to using it and under what circumstances?
11. Do you have an online fundraising plan? If not, is this a decision to not
    have one, or simply a blind spot? Are the folks doing development work
    (grants, etc.) part of the process of making decisions about the website,
    paypal, and technology planning?

Sweetly,

Charles Lenchner

(btw, given the silence over the past few months, after the talk about how
an open, participatory process has benefits, I'm just wondering how to
connect the call for volunteer help with the track record for decision
making until this point.... That's not a critique, just wondering out loud
what the narrative is at this point.)

-----Original Message-----
From: ussf-tech-bounces+clenchner=democracyinaction.org@lists.mayfirst.org
[mailto: ussf-tech-bounces+clenchner=democracyinaction.org@lists.mayfirst.org
] On Behalf Of Josue Guillen
Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 9:27 AM
To: Jason Nardi
Cc: ussf-tech@lists.mayfirst.org
Subject: Re: [Ussf-tech] About paypal and the USSF

hi jason,

the tech team definitely used paypal, so i am cc'ing that list.

it would be useful to find out where you are at and what is needed. my
plate is really full but more info would be useful in assessing how i
can support. i am sure others would feel the same way.

paz,

--josue

Jason Nardi wrote:

Hi Josue,

how's it going? The wsf2008.net http://wsf2008.net website is finally
published... though there is still an awful lot of work to be done... !
Are you at all available to help out somewhat ? The Agaric people need
some...

In any case, I'm writing you because I know you've used Paypal to accept
Donations on the USSF website and wanted to know how that worked out.
The Resource commission of the WSF International Council discussed this
and wants to put the possibility for people to donate online on the
wsf2008.net http://wsf2008.net website.

Please get back to me asap... since we are already very late...

Thanks!
Jason

--
Josué Guillén, Technology Manager
josue@thepraxisproject.org
The Praxis Project
1750 Columbia Road, NW
Second Floor
Washington, DC 20009
Phone: (202) 292-4252
Fax: (718) 770-7699
www.thepraxisproject.org

Praxis prak' sis 1. exercise or practice of an art, science or skill. 2.
The practical application of theory; action informed by theory. 3. The
synergy between theory and action; the highest form of practice.
The Praxis Project 1. An innovative not for profit institution dedicated
to capacity building, technical assistance, research, and training for
community-based policy change.

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